Why keep 'pulling us over if we never committed a crime?' black teens ask at carding event

Ahmed Hussein, a 19-year-old student at SirJohn A. Macdonald Secondary School, wants to know why, despite having never being charged with a crime, he keeps getting stopped by Hamilton police.

He says it's been four or five times already.

It was a good day, Tuesday, to ask that question. Justice Michael H.Tullochwas holding a public consultation in Hamilton on police street checks, also known as carding. It's part of a tour that will take Tullochto AjaxandMarkham this week.

Hussein wasn't even supposed to be at the event. He was sitting with five friends at a Tim Hortonsnearbywhen, he says, a man came in and asked them all if they'd like to join the meeting.

The students told Justice Michael H.Tullochand the crowd atthe Hamilton room in the central library on York Boulevard that they have all been carded and for some, on numerous occasions.

"All of us have been stopped by police for no reason and no charges have ever been laid, so what's the point of pulling us over if we never committed a crime," said anotherstudent from Sir John A. Macdonald Secondary School to the room.

Tullochhas been appointed to conduct the independent review of Ontario's new rules, to assess whether the regulation reflects the government's goal of ensuring that police-public interactions and engagements are consistent, bias-free and done in a way that promotes public confidence and human rights.

"I just want you to all know that we listened very carefully to all of your submissions," Tullochsaid.

New rules

Last year the province changed the rules on how police conduct street checksand how they can no longer"arbitrarily" collect someone's information but Tulloch heard Tuesday black people arestill a target for the practice.

Tullochwill also be reviewing the content of the regulation and assessing whether police officers, chiefs of police and police services boards are complying with it.

'Truthfully, sitting with these young brothers was really the whole purpose I think why justice Tulloch was here. They are the majority of the targets for this carding.'-ReubenAbib

The meeting heard from a number of community members from various backgrounds and ages. After an hour of table discussions, a representative from each table told Tulloch and his team how they felt about street checks.

Before the students provided feedback to the room, Tulloch sat with them, to listen. Hussein said Tuesday that he's "feeling good" after speaking with Tulloch.

"I just liked to talk to him and just tell him what happened to us."

Reuben Abibsatwith the students, helping to guidethe collective table discussion. He says,"this problem is very severe."

"Truthfully, sitting with these young brothers was really the whole purpose I think why justice Tulloch was here. They are the majority of the targets for this carding. What we've heard so far is every single one of them have been targets of the police for no reason," said Abib.

People brought up various aspects of street checks from personal experiences, to discussing how officers are required to provide a receipt or document after they stop an individual, to how officers were required to be trained on the new regulation before it came into effect.

I think that police services across the province are finding creative ways to circumvent the regulation.- Coun. Matthew Green

A general feel from the room was thatthere should be better trust between the community and police and more education to the public about new policing policies.

"We also feel that with the government, having all this money and power, have not been promoting this legislationmore often. They promote gun violenceand all that through TV commercials and radio, but this legislation they keep it on paper, they talk about it quietly," said 14-year-old MicaiahBeausoleil

A night for awareness

"Tonight was an excellent night to have awareness of the needs of the community. It's an independent review by Justice Tulloch and I find that we heard many voices tonight representing many populations of people and it's very beneficial," Hamilton Police Services Board member, Don MacVicar told CBC News.

When asked what would be done with the feedback from the meeting, MacVicar says, "we'll wait on Justice Tulloch's report.""We'll review it at that time."

Everything that you've said, I've been making note of and listening, and it will be considered in my recommendations.- Justice Michael H.Tulloch

Coun. Matthew Green wasin attendance and said "I'm under no illusions that this practice has stopped."

"I think that police services across the province are finding creative ways to circumvent the regulation," said Green.

Green says it's a practice of "big net fishing," which isn't yielding results that would be a reasonable balance against community interest.

"What we're hearing again, again and again is that the general public still believes this is unlawful practice. Police services have been unable to link this in any substantive way to a reduction in crime or to key cases that were generated from these arbitrary stops," said Green.

The findings are expected to be made public at the beginning of next year.

"I hear you all," Tulloch said."Everything that you've said, I've been making note of and listening, and it will be considered in my recommendations."

Consultations have already been held inThunder Bay,Bramptonas well as three in theTorontoarea. Two more are scheduled for this this week in Ajax and Markham. Four more will be held next month inWindsor,London,Ottawaand Sudbury.